Comments on: Is Proprietary the new Standard in the Mobile Industry? http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry Distilling market noise into market sense. Wed, 08 Feb 2012 21:37:29 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Elad Granot http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68043 Elad Granot Mon, 21 Dec 2009 18:13:40 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68043 Thanks for the comment, Joshua. I think it might be unfair to judge WAP today just by saying it 'never went anywhere'. To be fair to WAP I would examine how well it succeeded in generating business and meeting the market needs in its glamorous days and how widely it has been adopted. Even if the crown prince is the 'regular' Web, it doesn't mean the dying king was a bad one for it's time. - Elad Thanks for the comment, Joshua.

I think it might be unfair to judge WAP today just by saying it ‘never went anywhere’. To be fair to WAP I would examine how well it succeeded in generating business and meeting the market needs in its glamorous days and how widely it has been adopted.
Even if the crown prince is the ‘regular’ Web, it doesn’t mean the dying king was a bad one for it’s time.

- Elad

]]> By: Elad Granot http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68042 Elad Granot Mon, 21 Dec 2009 18:07:17 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68042 Hi Robin, I agree that IPR is an interesting topic that needs clarification, as most technology and business decision makers are non-lawyers and are not always aware of the sometimes critical legal implications. In standards meetings when talking directly about legal issues - people tend to take extra caution and refer you to the legal experts for full advice. The <a href="http://www.w3.org/" rel="nofollow">W3C</a> define themselves as an international community that develops web standards. My article by no means mentions an exhaustive list of all examples, and the W3C is definitely another example of a successful publisher of standards. I’m sure there are many other examples. - Elad Hi Robin,

I agree that IPR is an interesting topic that needs clarification, as most technology and business decision makers are non-lawyers and are not always aware of the sometimes critical legal implications. In standards meetings when talking directly about legal issues – people tend to take extra caution and refer you to the legal experts for full advice.

The W3C define themselves as an international community that develops web standards. My article by no means mentions an exhaustive list of all examples, and the W3C is definitely another example of a successful publisher of standards. I’m sure there are many other examples.

- Elad

]]> By: Marcos Caceres http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68041 Marcos Caceres Mon, 21 Dec 2009 11:31:54 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68041 @Mark Doherty, you can spin it - or "evangelize" it - however you want, but till you bring SWF to the W3C for standardization, you are not fooling anyone with your "ooohhh, we are only custodians of Flash whereby we add, fix and evolve the platform in an open way for our ecosystem". Proprietary is proprietary, my friend. And I bet Adobe would come out with guns blazing if anyone even tried to build and alternative flash player. @Mark Doherty, you can spin it – or “evangelize” it – however you want, but till you bring SWF to the W3C for standardization, you are not fooling anyone with your “ooohhh, we are only custodians of Flash whereby we add, fix and evolve the platform in an open way for our ecosystem”. Proprietary is proprietary, my friend. And I bet Adobe would come out with guns blazing if anyone even tried to build and alternative flash player.

]]> By: Robin Berjon http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68040 Robin Berjon Mon, 21 Dec 2009 10:07:32 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68040 An interesting article. I think it could be nicely complemented by a more thorough analysis of the pros and cons of the various IPR models chosen by different standard bodies for different parts of the stack. I'm also surprised that you don't mention W3C. As a participant over the past decade in many of the organisations that you mention, I find it (warts and all) to be the most apt at delivering high quality technical specifications that are relevant to the mobile market. An interesting article. I think it could be nicely complemented by a more thorough analysis of the pros and cons of the various IPR models chosen by different standard bodies for different parts of the stack.

I’m also surprised that you don’t mention W3C. As a participant over the past decade in many of the organisations that you mention, I find it (warts and all) to be the most apt at delivering high quality technical specifications that are relevant to the mobile market.

]]> By: Joshua Fox http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68036 Joshua Fox Sun, 20 Dec 2009 19:49:17 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68036 I enjoyed the article. As you point out, standards in the mobile web have had trouble getting off the ground. I wrote about the development process for WAP sites 8 years ago http://soa.sys-con.com/node/40793, but WAP itself never went anywhere. As you suggest, there is less pressure to standardize on the application level. I guess that regular Web standards will dominate. I enjoyed the article.

As you point out, standards in the mobile web have had trouble getting off the ground. I wrote about the development process for WAP sites 8 years ago http://soa.sys-con.com/node/40793, but WAP itself never went anywhere. As you suggest, there is less pressure to standardize on the application level. I guess that regular Web standards will dominate.

]]> By: Jack Shasha http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68029 Jack Shasha Fri, 18 Dec 2009 23:50:19 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68029 The article is impressive; it reflects extensive experience and insight. It is an "eye-opener" to me in the way standards are developed and their important role in the marketplace. The logic is presented methodically, and arguments are backed up with examples. Although I knew about standards, I had no idea of their implications. This is an article at a world-level that obviously comes from years of deep experience with the subject. I do have an opinion on one aspect that may differ from the author's. No matter how powerful the giants, they still fail to impose a standard when the benefits are not forthcoming, or the standard is obviously self-serving. We hear of the successes, but there are many failures, some behind the scenes, when the marketplace just did not "fall for it". The article is impressive; it reflects extensive experience and insight. It is an “eye-opener” to me in the way standards are developed and their important role in the marketplace. The logic is presented methodically, and arguments are backed up with examples. Although I knew about standards, I had no idea of their implications. This is an article at a world-level that obviously comes from years of deep experience with the subject.
I do have an opinion on one aspect that may differ from the author’s. No matter how powerful the giants, they still fail to impose a standard when the benefits are not forthcoming, or the standard is obviously self-serving. We hear of the successes, but there are many failures, some behind the scenes, when the marketplace just did not “fall for it”.

]]> By: Liz Coker http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68008 Liz Coker Thu, 17 Dec 2009 16:22:47 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68008 Hi Elad - Great article. We're a big fan of standards, but also realistic enough to know that to make money, you need to differentiate yourself. I think a proprietary solution that uses accepted/open standards for development & integration (what my company does), or a proprietary solution with a well designed SDK and developers program (i.e. like Microsoft) can drive a "de facto" standard and help to build a strong mobile ecosystem. With mobile being so fragmented, this is particularly important to the developer community if, the goal is cross-platform support. If the mobile app is too vertically integrated to the hardware, the market for developers remains niche or small. The cost to learn and develop to multiple mobile platforms is very high. If app/mobile service development can transcend the hardware (as in the PC space), the business opportunity grows dramatically. Liz Coker 5o9, Inc. Software to Power Mobile SaaS Hi Elad –

Great article. We’re a big fan of standards, but also realistic enough to know that to make money, you need to differentiate yourself. I think a proprietary solution that uses accepted/open standards for development & integration (what my company does), or a proprietary solution with a well designed SDK and developers program (i.e. like Microsoft) can drive a “de facto” standard and help to build a strong mobile ecosystem.

With mobile being so fragmented, this is particularly important to the developer community if, the goal is cross-platform support. If the mobile app is too vertically integrated to the hardware, the market for developers remains niche or small. The cost to learn and develop to multiple mobile platforms is very high. If app/mobile service development can transcend the hardware (as in the PC space), the business opportunity grows dramatically.

Liz Coker
5o9, Inc.
Software to Power Mobile SaaS

]]> By: Mark Doherty http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2009/12/is-proprietary-the-new-standard-in-the-mobile-industry/comment-page-1/#comment-68006 Mark Doherty Thu, 17 Dec 2009 12:00:33 +0000 http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/?p=1231#comment-68006 Hi Elad, Thanks for a great article on the question of standards. At Adobe we don't consider Flash to be a proprietary platform these days. In fact, we think of ourselves as custodians of Flash whereby we add, fix and evolve the platform in an open way for our ecosystem of developers and designers. We have in fact opened our key specs, the SWF binary format and streaming protocols to name just two. Although for the most part we already know that "most" users want us to drive, because the net effect is that they garner the consistency that would otherwise be lost with a contributor system. Even then Flash contains quite a few proprietary components from other companies for media playback. Flash Lite is a great example of a large company entering a new business, one where we sold licenses to our source code. The result was some fragmentation (*obviously*), some extensions to the platform and of course bugs that lived forever that could never addressed via updates. Historically the Flash Platform is successful because it is updatable, consistent and free to users. So we made the decision to sacrifice our highest growth business at Adobe to re-position the platform in line with these key principles on the desktop. That meant bringing the desktop player to mobile phones, making it consistent, updatable, free and widely available. Our developers, chipset vendors, OEMs and media partners all want us to listen to their needs, anticipate them. It's a subtle mix of open innovation, collaborative and what I would call "getting the job done". Regards, Mark Doherty Platform Evangelist Adobe Hi Elad,

Thanks for a great article on the question of standards.

At Adobe we don’t consider Flash to be a proprietary platform these days. In fact, we think of ourselves as custodians of Flash whereby we add, fix and evolve the platform in an open way for our ecosystem of developers and designers.

We have in fact opened our key specs, the SWF binary format and streaming protocols to name just two. Although for the most part we already know that “most” users want us to drive, because the net effect is that they garner the consistency that would otherwise be lost with a contributor system.

Even then Flash contains quite a few proprietary components from other companies for media playback.

Flash Lite is a great example of a large company entering a new business, one where we sold licenses to our source code. The result was some fragmentation (*obviously*), some extensions to the platform and of course bugs that lived forever that could never addressed via updates.

Historically the Flash Platform is successful because it is updatable, consistent and free to users. So we made the decision to sacrifice our highest growth business at Adobe to re-position the platform in line with these key principles on the desktop.

That meant bringing the desktop player to mobile phones, making it consistent, updatable, free and widely available.

Our developers, chipset vendors, OEMs and media partners all want us to listen to their needs, anticipate them. It’s a subtle mix of open innovation, collaborative and what I would call “getting the job done”.

Regards,

Mark Doherty
Platform Evangelist
Adobe

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